Government cuts could affect Pike County businesses with defense ties

Published 11:00pm Thursday, November 29, 2012

Republicans and Democrats seemed to be making no ground on Thursday in talks to avoid year-end tax increases and spending cuts that threaten to harm middle class pocketbooks.

At issue is a bipartisan desire to prevent the wholesale expiration of Bush-era tax cuts and the simultaneous implementation of across-the-board spending cuts. The potential spending reductions, to be divided between military and domestic programs, were locked into place more than a year ago in hopes the threat would have forced a compromise on a deficit reduction deal before now.

Failure to do so results in the country falling off a “fiscal cliff” at the end of the year.

“The fiscal cliff is an agreement that was made a couple of years ago that there would be some improvement on the deficit, otherwise there will be triggered spending cuts,” explained Scott Beaulier, executive director of Troy University’s Manuel H. Johnson Center for Political Economy.

Beaulier predicts that some kind of agreement will be reached before the end-of-the-year deadline, but said that decision will likely be a patch on America’s financial troubles instead of much needed, significant reform.

“This could be a Band-Aid applied to a very serious situation,” Beaulier said. “Longterm budgetary commitments need to be considered, but both sides will likely be coming back to the table to fight again. This is something that has been happening again and again because things are polarized in D.C. right now. Something is going to have to give.”

As talks stalled Thursday, Democrats said any holdup was the fault of Republicans, who are balking at President Barack Obama’s plan to raise tax rates on incomes higher than $200,000 for individuals and $250,000 for couples.

The GOP said the White House was offering unspecified spending cuts this year. Those would be followed next year by legislation producing savings from Medicare and other benefit programs of up to $400 billion over a decade, a companion to an overhaul of the tax code.

Beaulier said he feels families with incomes below $250,000 won’t experience tax increases, but it’s harder to predict where the government will cut spending and how much.

“A lot of the cuts will be focused on defense,” Beaulier said, noting Sikorsky’s Troy Operations, Lockheed Martin and Ft. Rucker would likely be affected. “Cuts, if targeted on defense, could affect our area financially.”

Ranking Member of the Senate Budget Committee Sen. Jeff Sessions (R-AL) expressed his concern Thursday on the Senate floor regarding “secret negotiations” related to the fiscal cliff.

“All of this secrecy allows the President to position himself as being in favor of a ‘balanced’ plan while the only comprehensive proposal he put on paper, his FY 2013 budget, increases taxes to fuel a further increase in spending,” Sessions said.

Rep. Martha Roby (R-AL) said the possibility of reaching a fiscal cliff is worrisome.

“I’m very concerned about the effect it could have on families in Pike County and throughout Alabama. Higher taxes, higher medical costs for seniors, military cuts – there are real-world consequences at stake. That’s why we’re working to avoid the fiscal cliff in the short term and deal with the national debt over the long term,” Roby said. “I’m concerned about President Obama and the Democrats insisting on tax increases that would be harmful to small businesses. The real problem is spending, and Americans want responsible, reasonable reforms that promote economic growth.”
The Associated Press contributed to this report.

 

  • BH1880

    Well what were you expecting? Democrats want to Tax the most productive and give to the least productive. Republicans are willing to raise taxes on the highest incomes with corresponding cuts to those that have been living off the taxpayer for years. News reports are that everything is on the cutting-block except entitlement programs (remember those free phones with 240 minutes). Instead of trying to reach an agreement, Democrats are campaigning and see the most important thing is to blame the Republicans. I see at lease 2 more businesses have closed in Troy.

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    • BH1880

      News this morning that Democrats are willing to make minor cuts to welfare, but campaigning against Republicans remain their priority rather than talking to Republicans.

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  • paradisereturn

    How aloof and detached can you be? – This same story is being replayed all over the country in a thousand different newspapers. The fact is if spending is cut dramatically in an already weak economy we can look forward to at least a year long recession. In the interest of partisanship delusional ideologues who can’t see past today are going to wreck our economy because then they don’t have to make a deal with Obama.
    If Republicans take us over the cliff because they want the richest Americans to be taxed 35% instead of 39% (the Clinton era rate) they can look forward to minority status for a very long time.
    The only solution is raising the top rates, taking capital gains taxes close to where they were in 90′s and reducing spending in measured steps over the long term. – If not our already fragile economy is about to be butchered and people are going to suffer. Quit being reactionary hacks and accept the implications of the situation.

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  • Curly

    Don’t we want government to cut spending? The government doesn’t create jobs anyway, right?

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  • Prophet

    The cuts to defense and entitlements need to be at least twice the amount proposed. The tax increases should never be allowed to take place. The problem this country has is not a revenue problem but a spending problem. Every with a triple digit IQ knows that already. Needless to say the 47% that receive these free rides on another mans hard earned dime will not agree with me.

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    • Curly

      “Every with a triple digit IQ knows that already.”

      Realistically we need both tax increases and spending cuts to truly tackle our deficit and national debt problem. Also, what “forty-seven percent” are you talking about?

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  • Prophet

    Paradisereturn, this country needs a financial collapse that imposes hardship on its population. We need civil unrest and a population reduction. There are not enough jobs within our society to create self sufficiency for every citizen. Since it is morally unfair to extort money (taxes) from one citizen in order to support another citizen then the next best option if decrease the population. It’s coming to that anyway. Just as well let us crash and get it over with. It is not right to tax any citizen a higher percentage than another citizen. That’s nothing more than transferring wealth at the point of a gun. It amounts to robbing a man at gunpoint.

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    • WDM

      Same thing pierce always said.

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    • mongoose

      It’s not the same thing. Not even close.

      Say the tax rate was 50% for everyone.
      Somebody making $7.50/hr at Wal-Mart would not be able to live off of the leftovers, without additional government assistance. They can’t live with that tax rate, even if they got a second job at $7.50/hr.

      Somebody making $250,000 could definitely live off of $125,000 just by altering their standard of living.

      You refer to taxes as extortion, and you believe differing tax rates based on income are “morally unfair” (which, by the way, makes no sense. The word you are going for is “immoral”.) You make an analogy to it being “robbery”. Yet you think it would be moral to let the country spiral into chaos so that poor people (who you assume are lazy) will be forced to work or die. You also thinks it’s okay for poor people to live in impossible conditions based on your version of a “fair” tax rate.

      I cannot assume you are a smart or moral person. If the poor people were all as horrible as you make them seem, they’d just LITERALLY commit robbery and take your stuff.

      Not all poor people are lazy. Or free loading.
      Not all people receiving a government benefit are bad.
      Your line of thinking is sad.

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      • mongoose

        BTW my comment is directed at prophet, not WDM

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      • Prophet

        Mongoose , what a person is capable of earning has nothing to do with fair taxation. I’m not against taxes , i’m against taxing one person a higher percentage than another person. That’s the point it becomes extortion. Progressive taxation is extortion any way you look at it. We’ll use your example. Either worker paid 50% of what they earned.To extort a higher percentage from the man that earned more is stealing. It has nothing to do with the lower earners inability to make the same amount.The government nor anyone else can make everyone in society equal.If a person is so poor they require assistance to survive in life then it’s usually because they are dumb , lazy or both. What benefit is that person to a society? They are parasites not assets.I don’t have anything against poor people but it’s not anothers responsibility to subsidize them.It’s certainly not the governments job to extort (steal) from me and others to feed them.The government is to irresponsible to be stewards of my money. It’s my money and i’ll donate it to the people i choose to , not who the government thinks deserves it. mongoose i have a real simple question.Why should the example that pay 150k rather than 125k by way of a higher percentage? Should he not reap the benefits of his labor and be capable of taking that 25k difference and buy him a new car? Why should he be forced to give it to the other lower earner? By the way immoral and morally unjust,”unfair” are the same identical thing. It’s not uncommon terminology, look it up sometime. It’s nothing more than a play on words. I’ll say this as clearly as i can. It is not my responsibility nor anyone else to support another human being in this world unless we choose to do so ! To force anyone is in fact EXTORTION at the point of a gun !

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        • mongoose

          If it’s extortion, and therefore illegal, then call the police.

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  • Prophet

    Curly the 47% i referred to is the number of households that receive any subsidy in any form from the US government. It includes SS and medicare although i dont personally view those as entitlements . They were designed as insurance after a person reaches retirement age. Actually at present GDP numbers it is impossible for the US to balance its budget as well as pay on the publicized 16 trillion debt. They would need to tax everyone 100% of their earning to do that. Needless to say those GDP numbers and revenue derived will increase dramatically as inflation is certain to take place in the near future. Hopefully not hyperinflation but that possibility does exist. The true long term liabilities of the US is estimated to be between 80 and 120 trillion by most every economist. No one can get it exact due to the hundreds of variables and affect that total. Even if the US falls off the “cliff” it will still be running almost a trillion dollar deficit each year. Remember the cliff only generates about 500-600 billion a yr in saving and addition taxes. It comes no where close to balancing the budget much less paying down the debt. Bottom line is this country will experience a financial collapse . I predict a inflationary collapse that debases the dollar to near worthlessness.

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    • mongoose

      Like a Pell Grant?

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      • Prophet

        Nope never had a pell grant either if your asking me the question. I guess you could say i did receive an entitlement by way of a public education for the first 8 yrs.After that i paid for all of my education. At that young age it was not a decision within my power to make. There is absolutely no question that i have paid enough just in property tax to more than pay for those 8 yrs of public education that i received. I dont believe in public education. It’s nothing more than indoctrination into a predetermined culture. I believe all education taxes should be discontinued and every parent should shoulder the responsibility of their kids education. Of course this will never happen so the next best thing is a voucher program that gives parents the option to choose a school that best fits their childs abilities and desires.

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  • BH1880

    As a Republican said the scariest words in the English language are “I am from the government and here to help”. Billions of dollars printed and spent on companies that have gone bankrupt. The value of money is approaching the value of toilet paper. He saved the auto industry, only to have it follow the path of Chrysler (that has not paid off it’s bailout either)and is now owned (58%) by Fiat of Italy. Chevrolet announced this morning that it will open a third factory in China, with many auto parts already made in China. UAW workers will follow in the wake of Twinkies workers.. 4 years ago coffee was $6.00 a can, now $10.00, Peanut butter was $4.00, now $7.00, pk. frozen vegetables $1.59, now $1.99, blue jeans $12.99, now $17.99 and not even made in this country. Inflation is about 8% and going to 15% next year and will not stop there. Increase spending only increases inflation. The damage has already been done, the amount of money spent and owed by the government is beyond comprehension. The calender says the year is 2,012 years and if the debt is paid off at $1 million a day it would take over 48,000 years. The Democrat plan, increase spending, drive companies overseas and blame Republicans.

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    • Prophet

      BH the money spent on entitlements concern me much more than the bailouts. I agree that the bailouts were a mistake but the entitlements are what broke this county. If the productive citizens were not taxed to death in order to support the non productive citizens we would see much more invested into industry that in turn would increase output thus GDP. The US needs to ship the welfare kings and queens to china and let them work and earn the 10k a yr rather than take 20-30k from the productive citizens to support them.

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      • mongoose

        Where do you get these figures?

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        • BH1880

          The prices are from shopping at stores at stores around Troy, while doing personal shopping, and I could have gone on and on. Google search for what is a trillion dollars or what is a trillion, there are many sites that attempt to explain that.

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    • mongoose

      No, where did you get the number 15% for next year’s inflation?

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  • Prophet

    By the way curly i am guilty of typos. EveryONE with a triple digit IQ could read through typos. LOL Here is one of dozens of articles that i’ve read that quote the 47% range i referred to. WDM that pierce guy must be a well knowledgeable man. Curly can you read this ? It’s easy….. i cdnuolt blveiee taht I cluod aulaclty uesdnatnrd waht I was rdanieg. The phaonmneal pweor of the hmuan mnid, aoccdrnig to a rscheearch at Cmabrigde Uinervtisy, it dseno’t mtaetr in waht oerdr the ltteres in a wrod are, the olny iproamtnt tihng is taht the frsit and lsat ltteer be in the rghit pclae. The rset can be a taotl mses and you can sitll raed it whotuit a pboerlm. Tihs is bcuseae the huamn mnid deos not raed ervey lteter by istlef, but the wrod as a wlohe. Azanmig huh? yaeh and I awlyas tghuhot slpeling was ipmorantt! if you can raed tihs forwrad it.

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  • Prophet
    • mongoose

      You realize that the only time this mentions 47% is when it mentions Mitt Romney referring to 47%.

      The article then goes on to list the percentage of recipients of various government benefits that believe they have NEVER received government benefits. So basically, a whole bunch of people who receive benefits from government in some shape, form, or fashion, do not believe the handout that they get is a form of welfare.

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      • Prophet

        Mongoose most that receive entitlements wont admit they are receiving charity that was extorted from someone. They believe they are owed what they get just because they were born. Which of course is a fallacy. Many were born into a family of parasites and no one will ever convince them of what they really are because that’s all they’ve ever known. A financial collapse will prove them wrong. That’s why i look forward to it. When a billion bucks worth of food stamps will buy 3 raw eggs as it did in Zimbabwe they’ll learn the realities of life, the hard way. The ones living in public housing wont even be able to grow tomatoes. They’ll steal and we’ll kill. Problems solved !! LOL

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        • mongoose

          That’s not going to happen.
          You are being ridiculous.

          I would be willing to bet that the people on food stamps know and would admit that they know that is considered “welfare”.

          It’s the people that are receiving other benefits such as student loans, pell grants, or mortages, etc. that do not consider themselves to be the “parasites”, as you called them.

          Your choice of wording reflects a lot of anger and a sense that you are somehow superior to people who receive government assistance.

          But if these people are as dumb, lazy, etc. as you say they are, and they’re ending up with your cake, well then I guess they’re smarter than you make them out to be.

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  • OldSchoolPike3Worker

    Look folks, the gig is up. The fix is in. So far this whole fiscal cliff is about raising taxes on job creators when the real issue is baseline budgeting and the assumption that if spending doesn’t go up then we must consider it a cut. Any tax increases or spending cuts that this bunch in Washington comes up with will just be a symbolic gesture. Unless and until the fiscal culture of our federal government makes a 180 degree change, we are going bankrupt. We are looking at an unsustainable scenario here. The 2012 election has proven to me that we can’t vote our way out of this. We are screwed!

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  • Curly

    Prophet, you don’t receive any subsidies from the US government? Do you have student loans, a mortgage, or children?

    Also, to people thinking the United States can go bankrupt, that’s not really possible since the US is in control of its own currency. There will never be an issue of whether the government can pay someone, because they can always “print money” to cover their debts. Of course, the only problem with that is it devalues the dollar.

    BH1880, annual inflation rates are not out of line historically. In the last 20 years, inflation has not passed 4% annually, in fact in 2009, there was actually deflation of 0.34%.

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    • BH1880

      I do not remember which of many sites I read those figures. Can you tell me why food and fuel are not included in inflation figures? If inflation went down why have prices continued to rise?

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      • mongoose

        Because things other than inflation affect prices.

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  • Prophet

    No curly i dont have any student loans, no mortgage and my children are grown. I have never received nor wanted any money from the government.I just want them to stop taking what i earn and give to others ! The weimar republic and zimbabwe thought they could print themselves out of debt too. As anyone can clearly see it doesn’t work. The US can default and will default when the dollar is no longer used as the worlds reserve currency. Six other countries are now using their currencies for bi-lateral trades and many more will soon follow . If the euro wasnt in dire straits the dollar would already be in more serious trouble than it already is.

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  • Prophet

    Curly do you actually understand exponential math , doubling time and what the posted inflation rate of 3.5 does to prices and how rapidly it does it? 3.5 average inflation is a killer over a century. In the past 100 yrs it has devalued the dollar to 6 cents of purchasing power. Fractional reserve has guaranteed the collapse of the dollar because there is never ever enough dollars to cover the debt owed.

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    • Curly

      So you had kids. When they were living with you, did you take the standard dependency deduction for them, which is essentially a subsidy to have children? All else being equal, if you and your spouse made $60,000/year and a married couple with no children made the same, you’d be taxed at a lower rate. Do you think that was fair?

      As for inflation, if you had $1 in 1912 and stuck it under the mattress for 100 years, you deserve to essentially have nothing now. You say it takes $1 to buy what you could for $0.06 in 1912, but if you bought $1 in gold in 1912, you’d have about $90 today. The average yearly interest rate over the last 100 years is higher than it has been during any year of the 21st century. There is no trend toward an increased inflation rate.

      While the national debt is at a record high, as a percentage of GDP, it is still a good deal lower than the historical high.

      And inflation isn’t necessarily a bad thing unless you are sitting on cash, have a fixed income, or stuck in something like long term bonds. For a slumping economy, it certainly boosts consumption and relieves those in debt. I’d certainly like to have a fixed rate home mortgage on a $150,000 house then see inflation take over and double prices. I just got a house at half price!

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      • BH1880

        You are right about one thing, Seniors (The Greatest Generation), the ones that built this country to the greatest nation on earth, the ones that won WWII (no war have been won sense), the ones that paid social security and put away savings in CD now paying .06%, the ones that a government will decide whether they will get the medical help they deserve will be the ones hurt most. You do know that Curly and Abe Vigoda are two different people?

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        • Curly

          You mean the generation that worked under a tax structure that taxed the wealthiest upwards of 90% or the generation that created the welfare state while ironically declaring war on communism? The DOE, DOL, DOA, HHS, HUD these were all federal agencies created during the this “greatest generation”. The growth of the MIC into a force that spends $600B a year of taxpayers money occurred under the era of the greatest generation.

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      • Prophet

        Curly i view the ability to claim dependents as an avenue for the government to extort less from me. They are not giving me anything , they are extorting less of MY money from me. There is a clear distinction between the two. Inflation is built into our monetary system. Money is created by debt. Without debt there would be no money.Inflation is automatically created by the interest on that debt.To maintain perfect equilibrium inflation should match interest over an extended period of time.That is what debt to GDP ratio is designed to denote. I agree our debt to gdp was higher during WWII but this country had a manufacturing base to dig themselves out. Not to mention we were much more agrarian oriented. The big difference between then and now is the population and entitlement programs. Those will be the downfall of our society. Simple exponential math ! Your example about the dollar stuck under a mattress is wrong. If it was a double eagle it would be worth about 1600.00 fiat dollars today.It has intrinsic value. A fiat dollar has no intrinsic value and that is the underlying problem with our present monetary policy. A fiat dollars value has been based on oil to some degree for the past 40 yrs.That’s ending as we speak. When the world no longer needs dollars to buy oil we will see the final nail in its coffin.

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        • Curly

          So it is okay for you to claim dependents to pay less taxes, where someone who doesn’t have kids has to pay more? Do you think that is any more fair than someone who receives welfare? Essentially, people who do not have children have to offset what you would have paid had you not had kids. Seems like a government subsidy to have children to me. But since you took advantage of that deduction, it is okay in your eyes, right? How dare the government tax your money. Let them take another person’s right?

          As for you saying without debt there would be no money. I don’t agree with that. Money was created as a mechanism for trade.

          Also, currency being tied to some commodity is not necessarily a good thing because it prevents governments from regulating their own currency during economic crises.
          I doubt you’ll find many economists who think reverting to the gold standard as a good idea.

          As for you noting that if it was a double eagle it would be worth $1600 today, I think you missed the point. My point was that the intrinsic value of US currency devalues over time, you should know this and not sit on large amounts of currency, but invest it. My point was also long as you invested your money in something like gold you’d be fine in 100 years, but if you just sat on your money, you’d be in bad shape. It’s a bad idea just to sit on money. Use it to buy something, that is the purpose of it.

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  • Prophet

    When discussing the word “value” one must remember the basic definition of the word. Nothing on this planet has any value unless we as humans require it to survive. Money itself is nothing more than a standardized means of exchange for those items required (or desired) to survive.It’s value is directly correlated to supply and demand.Money is worthless without the ability to trade it for a necessity (or desire).Anytime the supply increases the quantity of the demand increases, not the quality of the demand.The quality decreases as the quantity increases.

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  • Prophet

    Curly, in reply to your question concerning dependents.No it’s not fair for someone with kids to pay more taxes than me. I never said it was. You’ve missed the whole point of my comments.There’s very little about the tax structure in the US i do agree with.I thought i had already posted a comment that i believe the only fair tax is a consumption tax.Like a sales tax.For example tax everyone 20% on every dollar they spend. Since most people spend almost everything they ear this would be fair. Everyone would be taxed based on their ability to spend. There’s many books that explain our monetary system but watching this video will give you an overview of how money is created from debt. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dmPchuXIXQ

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    • Curly

      I think a federal sales tax is a bad idea because it would shift burden onto the poor who require all of their income to survive and greatly reduce the burden on the wealthy who are able to save/invest a large portion of their income. So the effective tax rate on the poor would be 20% of their income and on the wealthy could be almost 0% of their income. Also, a large sales tax discourages consumption because of the large penalty you are essentially paying.

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      • Prophet

        Curly why should the poor be exempt from paying their fair share? Is it another persons fault that someone is poor? We were all born in the same country , provided the same education and have the same opportunities. Why should someone that succeeded subsidize someone that didnt by giving them a break on taxes? Let me give you an analogy. Would you believe it to be fair if all products were sold to individuals based upon what they earn? For example would it be right for you to pay 10 bucks a gallon for gas just because you earn more than i do? It’s no more fair for one person to pay a higher percentage of taxes than it would be to ask one person to pay anymore for products and services than another.The truth is that a business would get prosecuted if they tried it. It’s discrimination just as it is discrimination to charge one person a higher tax rate than another. Taxes are the opposite than most everything else in life. In other things the more you buy the better deal you you get. With taxes the more you pay the more they want you to pay. Bottom line is just because someone can afford to pay more it dont make it right to force them to. That’s plain and simple extortion. I believe rich people would actually pay more with a flat tax. They wouldnt have all the avenues for tax write offs that they do now. Most business will make decisions that take full advantage of those deductions.

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  • Prophet

    curly concerning the double eagle. No i didnt miss your point. i was saying the same thing. Of course invest your money but invest it in something that has intrinsic value. Never save fiat currency because it is designed to be debased. The best investments has always been something that has a limited supply.Gold, silver , copper etc. Never invest in government bonds because what little interest they earn is lost by way of inflation. Doing so has historically been a safe haven and it is designed to allow your money to retain its value but not increase its real value (purchasing power) over an extended period of time.

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  • Prophet

    Curly in response to your 9:34 comment. Just how in the world can you define a mortgage or student loans as welfare? They must be repaid with interest. No one has to pay back welfare or food stamps. That’s ridiculous to even think such a thing. You did sense it correctly when you commented i am angry. Yes i am superior to the people that live off entitlements. I am self sufficient, they are parasites. They themselves are not smarter than me . They are lazy , worthless ignorant individuals that have a government extorting from the self sufficient productive to fund their lifes. Without the government they would cease to exist because most (not all) are to dumb and worthless to survive on their own ability. I am ecstatic that this country is broke and almost at the point of financial and social collapse. As i said earlier , i look forward to that day. That’s what it will take to restructure this country to a viable, productive society. Bandaids will no longer work.

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    • Curly

      Prophet, I am not referring to the loans themselves, but the mortgage interest deduction and the student loan interest deduction than can be deducted from you income tax liability. It is essentially a government tax incentive to buy a home. Isn’t that essentially subsidized housing? All else being equal, if you make $50,000 and buy a home or owe student loans why should you pay less taxes than someone who makes $50,000 and rents or had no student loans. Just like if you have kids, or buy a fuel efficient car or make your home energy efficient or donate to charity. These are all choices you make with your money. If you make that same as someone else, you should not have to pay because you chose not to have kids or donate to charity, etc.

      Of course if we ignore the idea of income utility and the concept that each unit of income is subject to diminishing marginal utility , which many conservative do when it favors them, then everyone should pay the exact same in taxes regardless of income. If the US budget is $3T and there are 300,000,000 people in the US then each individual should be responsible for $10,000 right? So if you have a family of four and make $20,000,000/year you pay $40,000 in taxes or if you have a family of four and make $38,000, you pay $40,000 in taxes.

      Kinda dumb isn’t it?

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      • Prophet

        Curly i have clearly not defended any deductions. Be it mortgage interest, student load interest. I have said i dont like very few if any part of tax structure. Remember i advocate a flat rate tax at some percentage of gross income. The gross amount will vary but the same percentage should be deducted for taxes from that amount. Just using round figures, if someone makes 10k they pay a thousand. If they make 100k their tax would be 10k. if their gross was a million then that would pay 100k at a 10% flat tax rate. Everyone would be paying their fair share. There is no other way to view the above example other than it being fair everyone. Whats someone is capable of earning is based solely upon their ability. Just because one person is not capable of earning 100k is no reason to take more from them and give it to the one making 10k in an attempt to make everyone equal in life. Any percentage can be decided on. It could be 25-30 percent. Most of us are paying over 50% income tax right now and dont even realize we’re paying it. I know i pay well over 50% of my gross in taxes and a large percentage of the US population does. For every dollar you earn you will pay roughly 25 fed, 15 SS, 5 state and 3 medicare. Thats 48 cents out of that dollar. Then when you spend it you pay another 9 cents. That totals 57 cents. You’re only left with 43 cents out of the dollar. That dont even include taxes on such things as gas nor 3% you pay when you use a credit or debit card. People just dont think about all the clandestine ways we are being taxed.

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  • Aborted

    I am willing to bet that there are not very many folks living in Pike County Alabama who earns or has earned over $200.000 annually. Why would a bunch of poor and lower middle-class folks defend the rich? Many rich folks would not extend their hand for you to shake it. These folks don’t care about you’ll so find something positive to do. Go rake an old lady’s lawn or take your parents to the park.

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    • Curly

      Really, odd that most of the states that receive the most federal aid per capita are Red states. I’ve actually talked to Republicans would would rather have a flat tax rate that would tax them more and corporations and the wealthy less if it meant that the poor paid more or got less. Not sure why there is such animosity towards giving to the poor. Seems they’d rather burn their money than give it to the poor.

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      • Prophet

        Curly i had rather burn my money than have it stolen from me and given to people that didnt earn it. If i choose to give it to them is one thing but having it extorted form me and given to them is a totally different thing. Matter of fact i went galt in 2002. I could earn twice what i earn now. I choose not to. No reason for me to work harder and have most of it taken from me and given to someone else. That’s the philosophy i live by.

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    • Prophet

      Blood it is not defending rich people when they are being discriminated against because they are capable of earning more than others. It has everything to do with them being treated equally. The truth is that most people that make over 250k a yr are in the unique position to pass any additional taxes onto the man making 20k a yr. Therefore taxing them is really nothing more than taxing yourself in an indirect way. These people are going to make just as much money as they want to make. Any additional cost is just passed along to consumers. If they go up a million a yr on warren buffets taxes then he will just go up 2 million a yr on the products and services he provides. I dont understand why people dont realize this.

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      • Curly

        How would most of what you make go to someone else? I suppose you think all of your taxes are given to the lazy bums. Hyperbole much?

        Secondly, it wasn’t until the Reagan administration slashed the top marginal tax rate that executive pay began to take off. From the 1930s to the 1970s, a high marginal tax rate made ridiculous pay not very feasible. While those making $250K now would not be near the inflation adjusted highest marginal tax rate of that era, there are plenty of executives who simply would not be able to adjust their pay to compensate what they would be taxed.

        And saying you’d rather burn your money than have it taxed and given to some poor family…greed much? You complain, but I’d be interested in knowing how much you actually paid in income taxes last year.

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        • Prophet

          Curly you need to research progressive tax. That’s why i said the more i earn the less make (net) from the gross. I consider it foolish to earn more to be extorted for someone else benefit.If for some reason i need to earn more then i will but for over 10 yrs “going galt” has served me well and at the same time has taken a few dollars away from entitlement programs. If everyone adopted this philosophy we could soon destroy the entitlement programs by starving them out. (truth is thats what is taking place now ) Not because people like myself has starved them out but because the government signs blank checks to fund them. The end result result is the same. As far as you comment about executives pay adjustment to avoid taxes. That will not be their main course of action. They will increases the prices of their products and services to compensate for the additional tax cost.I believe i’ve said that earlier.Just as any business. When we have a cost (or tax) increase we just pass it on to customers. It’s not like it cost us anything. People just cant seem to grasp that simple fact.The state added a 3 dollar cost to one of the products i sell a few yrs ago. Myself and others that sell these products simply raised the price t0 consumers 5 bucks. We actually profited from the additional fees that alabama imposed. That’s just one small example of hundreds that i know of.That’s how it works in the real world and to believe it doesnt is living in fantasyland. As far as what i paid in taxes last yr. I can tell you this it was very very little because i make every decision possible to avoid them. Mostly by way of depreciation and deductible throughout the yr.It’s really must smarter to discontinue the tax deductions than it is to increase the marginal tax rates. Most of us dont care what the rate is as long as the deductions are still in place for us to take advantage of. Although i still believe it to be extortion for them to tax higher earners a higher percentage of their earnings.Most wealthy people would pay much more in taxes if they did away with all deductions and everyone paid a flat tax on earning or a consumption tax. The only thing i can say good about our present tax structure is damn God for deductions and write offs !!! lol By the way a person desiring to keep what they earned and not give it to someone else that chooses not to earn has nothing to do with greed. It has everything to do with what is fair and just. Are you saying that you dont mind giving half your paycheck away in taxes to support others?? You are a rarity if that’s the case.I dont know of anyone that likes someone extorting half the money they worked for and earned.

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  • BH1880

    I did not know this was still going on. I remember what effect LBJ’s “war on poverty or The Great Society” and the war in Vietnam had on the economy. Back then there was no talk of complete collapse of the dollar as now.

    https://www.aier.org/article/7550-inflation-risk-around-corner

    http://www.caseyresearch.com/cdd/what-inflation-could-look-2014

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    • Prophet

      BH there is no question in my mind that the dollar will collapse due to inflation if historical treat is followed. I’ve studied every society that has experienced a inflationary collapse and we are following in their exact footsteps. When the world no longer needs dollars for bi lateral trades the dollar will be dead.The dollars value cannot be sustained when it’s purchasing power is restricted to within the US borders.

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      • Curly

        Do you have a time table to when…I mean you’re still here in the US so obviously it isn’t next week…

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        • Prophet

          Curly i have no time table but i plan to stay here. I think i will be able to benefit financially from a dollar/societal collapse. It’s something that will happen gradually. The seeds are planted and it has already started.

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        • Prophet

          Course if the derivatives crash then this country will crash within a week or two. It’ll be as quick as it was when Lehman and AIG crashed.

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  • Prophet

    Gold and silver are not the best investments . Brass and lead is !

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  • Prophet

    To Curly and readers of these comments . I earlier posted this line “The only thing i can say good about our present tax structure is damn God for deductions and write offs !” I have no idea why i typed what i did . Maybe i was on the phone at the time and typed what i thought or said but it should have read Thank God.

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